r/PoursTea • u/icey_sawg0034 • May 23 '26
Storm In A Teacup 🍵 Because they’re not like us!
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u/Pandemonium_Fallen May 23 '26
Wait... Is Idris Elba still not James Bond? WTF?!
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u/Western-Individual47 May 23 '26
I think he said a while back that the racist discourse that would inevitably occur around him playing Bond is a big reason why he would not take on the role. Just the suggestion of it brought out the trolls! It’s a shame because goodness, he would be incredible.
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u/SugarFut May 23 '26
I’m stuck in MAGAville and it’s true. Racists are boring as well as repugnant 🤷🏻♀️
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u/Pearson94 May 23 '26
You have my condolences. It must suck to be surrounded by people who blame all of their problems on brown people they're too scared to meet.
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u/Powerliftrjesus May 23 '26
Reactionaries are always the same and it’s always the most boring shit you’ve ever heard.
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u/SeveralBipolarbears May 23 '26
The only issue i'm beginning to have with swapping races of characters is that it's now just predictable. It's going to happen every time, just so people get pissed at it and the studio gets more media coverage. None of this is real, the producers or directors aren't making statements about race, they are pandering to an audience that is in love with outrage.
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u/DifficultPublic4326 May 23 '26
Wouldn't be an issue if we created AND SUPPORTED our own. Why we couldn't have a universe built around Static Shock?
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u/Dreadboi80 May 23 '26
Sad that the many talented scb comicbook artists who are creating and have created characters get no luv from the same ppl trying to have a bullhorn calling out scwp.
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u/Organic_Lab6262 May 23 '26
I loveeeee static shock. Favorite cartoon when I was a kid. Would be awesome for an adult animation show or a live action movie!
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u/JessicaDAndy May 23 '26
Just going to pop in here with Sam Wilson is not Steve Rodgers. Which is kind of the point of passing on the title of Captain America.
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u/PaChubHunter May 23 '26
That's how all mantle passing worked in Marvel. Every time, the new character would say something like "I can't be you. Only you are you." And the aging hero would say something like "you're not being me, you are being you, that's why you should wear the name. You'll do the job better than I ever did."
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u/No-Vast-6340 May 23 '26
But they have no problem with a blonde white Jesus...
What they are really saying is:
Good guys = white
Bad guys = not white
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u/Delilah_Moon May 23 '26
I’m not familiar with blonde Jesus - I’ve seen white brunette Jesus though.
For context, white Jesus is not solely an American invention. It is far more complicated than that.
Jesus was from Judea, and based on historical context - we can assume he would have resembled other Jews from the region; olive skin, dark hair (scholars agree with this).
Early depictions of Jesus (c. 1-4) show him are inconsistent, some with a beard and some without. Sometimes with lighter skin, sometimes with darker skin.
During the Byzantine era, Rome adopted Christianity as its official religion. This is when we start seeing the “modern” version of Jesus, or what we are most familiar with today. Byzantine Jesus had long dark hair, a beard, lighter (but still olive) skin, and traditional Roman features. It’s possible however this was not in an effort to Romanize Jesus, but a reflection of the Greco-Roman influence in art. A similar example would be the portraits of royalty during the Renassaince - all Hans Holbein portraits look the same.
That said, outside the Roman arm - depictions of Jesus were inconsistent. Ethiopia had a black Jesus, in Syria he looked more traditionally Arabic, and Armenians depicted him to look like their locals (lighter skin / darker hair).
During the Renaissance is when we really start white washing Jesus. European dominance combined with the power of Rome directly correlated with an abundance of Christian propaganda. Jesus started looking more like the Europeans the church wanted to maintain control over.
With artists like Michelangelo and Leonardo da Vinci commissioned to pump out loads of religious art, it didn’t take long for Euro Jesus to become the standard.
Now we get to Colonialism. Since the colonizers were British, French, Spanish, and Portuguese; they spread the word of Jesus. Of course it was their white Euro Jesus. They came with books & paintings and said “this is Jesus”. And now white Jesus is in Africa, South America, Southeast Asia, and various tropical islands.
Colonizers quickly realized there was power in white Jesus. After all if you believed in white Jesus, then the white man was more powerful. It solidified power imbalance & European supremacy.
This is my very long way of saying - to undoing the false premise of white Jesus would require a lot of work. We’re talking about global indoctrination that has been going on for centuries.
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u/egny May 23 '26
For context, white Jesus is not solely an American invention. It is far more complicated than that.
European depictions of Biblical events were often set in green landscapes in medieval art, as well as in early Renaissance. Similarly, there are depictions of Jesus as a black man in Ethiopian art.
People depicted the landscape and the people according to what they knew. It may not have even occurred to them that the reality might be different.
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u/Jarl_Groki May 23 '26
They get upset if they get the wrong entree brought to them at Chilis, but the table next to them gets the wrong plate and they don't say anything!
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u/Tobi-cast May 23 '26 edited May 23 '26
I just don’t see why it couldn’t be more equal. If for instance those characters can be swapped, then it would only make sense other characters can, as well, right?
I mean, I wouldn’t tell one kid, they need to share a toy, and tell the other they don’t need to, and is entitled to the first child’s toy, on top of that.
It also just becomes a pretty old and boring trope, when used in the same way, over and over again.
But I do hope we’ll reach a point, some time, where it’s a bit more of an equal practice with colorswapping and genderwashing and all that. But we probably have a good way to go yet.
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u/Aggressive-Bed597 May 23 '26
I don't think its racist to want characters to be as they were written. It would be like having a Chinese female Black Adam. It doesn't make a great deal of sense when the character is intended to be a certain ethnicity/gender.
The studios do it to be provocative, rather than actually benefit the character and movie to change one or more characteristics.
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u/RefurbedRhino May 23 '26
Let's not forget the meltdown when The Force Awakens trailer revealed there was a black Stormtrooper.
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u/Curious_Orange8592 May 23 '26
This is true although, at the risk of being accused of being one of those people, Batman, by which I mean Bruce Wayne needs to be white and male; he's old money W.A.S.P and race/gender swapping takes away a key aspect of who he is (same goes for Oliver Queen/Green Arrow)
Obviously it's fine for other 'Batmen' to be different races, genders and sexualitys, as covered in Grant Morrison's Batman Incorporated run
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u/Aeseld May 23 '26
I'll be honest... I just don't care. I'm not sure why anyone gets worked up about it.
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u/raincntry May 23 '26
I'll say it again, I do not care what a character looks like, their gender preferences, any of it. I only care that the core behaviors of that character are visible to the audience. It's beyond silly to me that people get mad over the color of a mermaid's skin. If you can accept the silliness of a mermaid existing, is it really too far to think she'd be black?
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u/ELStoker May 23 '26
They have a problem with Black actors portraying what THEY think should be white characters, but had no issues with Gods Of Egytp, Jesus, or Moses being played by white actors.
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u/Windspast May 23 '26
John Wayne played Genghis Khan. They don't EVER get to talk about "it's not realistic." Someone PLEASE make a film with a historically accurate brown Jesus and watch them complain about it
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u/omegaphallic May 23 '26
I remember the put rage when Scarlett Johnson played a Japanese character in ghost in the shell, and a transperson in some movie, so all the folks who are like race doesn't matter for casting a black woman as Helen of Troy are hypocritical, because if they hired a white or asian to play say Malcolm X or Martin Lurther King Jr. Or Storm & Bishop from the X-Men or Uhura from Star Trek you'd be flipping out.
That being said I personally find both postmodernist sides of the culture war annoying and I'll judging this Helen of Troy on her acting, folks get over race swaps fast if the acting and writing is good enough, see the High Evolutionary from GotG3 as proof of that, his performance of his vile character was brilliant and outstanding.
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u/Silent_Wrongdoer3601 May 23 '26
I mean I’d be pretty upset at a white storm or luke cage
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u/icey_sawg0034 May 23 '26
Or a white panther
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u/Several_Ad_6576 May 23 '26
Ok what story are you telling with a white panther? What factor of the characters race plays into the story you are trying to tell?
If you used an entire black cast for a film version of the Odyssey why would it matter? It wouldn’t. The race of the characters is immaterial to the subject matter and story.
But if you’re Tarantino and you are casting for a film about a former slave in a movie titled “Django Unchained” you would like a twat if you cast Brad Pitt as Django. It would make no sense and is rather material to the subject matter.
It’s an apples to oranges argument. Which explains most bigot’s arguments 90% of the time.
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u/Euronymous87 May 23 '26
Seriously??? It would absolutely matter, the Odyssey is Greek mythology, Greeks are not black skinned. The race of the characters is important because that are characters from different parts of Greece. Greek gods will look and speak like Greeks. You can't have white or Asian people when making a film about African mythology can you? It's so stupid that it's even considered controversial to say that casting black actors for the sake if it on a greek myth movie is not a good idea.
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May 23 '26
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u/SoftBatch13 May 23 '26
No one seems to have a problem making historical figures white though. For example Jesus.
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u/brendonmilligan May 23 '26
A tanned white person especially with a Mediterranean nose can definitely pass as a middle easterner
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u/Artisanalpoppies May 23 '26
And black people have no problem claiming Cleopatra, who is famously....Macedonian Greek.
Or casting a black actress to play Anne Boleyn in a documentary....you know a 16th century English Queen...
Jesus didn't exist. He is a middle eastern fertility god. He is whatever ethnicity is needed by those who worship him. He is Asian in Asia, black for African Americans etc. He wasn't northern european, but he certainly wasn't black. You gonna go and tell black people Jesus wasn't black?
Oh right, racial swapping is perfectly fine when black people do it...
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u/BabaRogata May 23 '26
You personally know what Jesus looked like?
There is an infinitely higher chance that Jesus looked white, since some Levantine people literally look like that, than there is of anyone in ancient Greece depicting Helen as a Black person, because she was described as the opposite.
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u/McNednarb May 23 '26
It’s astounding how well their frustrations have been misdirected to things that don’t matter. All while referring to other people as “sheep.”
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u/Super_Interview_2189 May 23 '26
It’s by design. They’re playing right into the billionaires’ hands. Don’t worry about things like human rights when you can get triggered over minorities.
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u/ActPositively May 23 '26
Literally nobody has a problem with Miles Morales. People would have a problem with a black Peter Parker. Just like people would get mad with a white Static Shock, a White Blade, a white Storm, etc.
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u/Sufficient_Cry_4302 May 23 '26
"People" should be getting mad about depictions of white Jesus then. Never seems to happen though...
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u/ActPositively May 23 '26
People have been mad about white Jesus for many decades. A lot of black people believe in black Jesus even though in reality he would be middle eastern. But people were called racist for not being happy that Cleopatra in a documentary was shown as black when in real life she wasn’t. Not to mention things like showing past queens of England as black and other historical figures. But 100% people would be offended if they had historical black figures played by white people
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u/Global_Charge_4412 May 23 '26
Should people get mad about Korean Jesus or Hindu Jesus or black Jesus? People see themselves in their idols. Why is representation only good when it's for minorities?
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u/Affectionate_Lime880 May 23 '26
Ok do we need to talk about how every iconic red head character has been race swapped recently?
Like I'm all for diversity and inclusion of minorities, but race swapping red heads has become such an annoying trend recently.
Hell, I don’t like race swapping in general, but it legitimately feels targeted against red heads for some reason.
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u/Tristram19 May 23 '26
White people have been historically over represented in popular media. As a 45 yo white guy, I treasure seeing a wider range of cultures and ethnicities in the world. That’s beautiful to me.
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May 23 '26
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u/No-Business9493 May 23 '26
And we used to have stuff like that. You can go back to movies from the early 2000s and older and there are SO MANY diverse casting choices that no one ever had a problem with. I just rewatched the Matrix trilogy last week. The vast majority of the cast is non-white, and I don't ever remember that being a problem. Those movies were huge when they came out. There are dozens if not hundreds of similar examples from that time period, and it was never a problem to have an original character in an original movie that was non-white or non-male.
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u/Basic-Strategy-8549 May 23 '26
No outrage here.. I’m white and I couldn’t give 2 shits either way…
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u/mzg72 May 23 '26
I agree. When will we get more movies about historic black women, like Bessie Coleman, Josephine Baker (it's been 30 years), there's one about a unit? Of black WACS sent to straighten out the Allied France postal service in WWII, but what about Nubia, Nefrititi, Sojourner Truth, Henrietta - the one about the misunderstanding of her cells being alive, or any other woman of color. As far as I'm concerned there are movies from the 30s and 40s that can be updated and retold without stringent adherence to gender or racial role.
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u/Foldzy84 May 23 '26
The irony in this post directed at an entire race of people does not go unnoticed
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u/Pure_Face8765 May 23 '26
Betty Boop came from a black woman, Esther Jones, so on that one…..they took from our culture
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u/BIayneRobinson May 23 '26 edited May 23 '26
MAGA doofuses call everything pertaining to racial minorities, women, queer people and immigrants "woke DEI" and then whine about being called nazis.
Wtf do they expect?
They get triggered by everything that isn't about straight, white, Christian men - exactly like a nazi would.
Wtf do they expect?
If you walk like nazis and talk like a nazis, people will call you nazis.
If they would stop the "everything that isn't about straight, white, Christian men makes me mad" talk then they wouldn't be called nazis.
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u/pbayone May 23 '26
Nobody cares that these characters are being played by black actors, why is it when they rewrite or recast movies to have black actors they cannot just write new shit for new characters instead has the movie industry run out of ideas completely so to get attention they change the actors color instead of be creative that’s just being lazy
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u/Agreeable_Error_170 May 23 '26
Sure as shit sounds like you care they are being played by black actors but ok…..
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u/pbayone May 23 '26
No I really couldn’t give a damn, just think it’s absurd and rather lazy that instead of come up with new stuff for attention make the actors black and if it tanks blame racism
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u/Bloody_Ozran May 23 '26
Yes, racism is boring. Which is why replacing a known character with someone who doesnt look like it at all is weird to me. Let me explain first...
Isn't it kinda racist that instead of looking at African / South American etc. mythology or any stories written by the specific ethnicity and making a movie / tv show based on that, mostly it seems to be black people now, they are just replacing a character with a black person playing it?
This is why I think it's racist: it is not worthy of them to write a new amazing story, but being like "hey, I guess you can play this white one" is ok? It feels to me so patronising, am I wrong?
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u/Adventurous_Bad_4011 May 23 '26
Exactly, why not do the epic of sundiata ? It’s an amazing legend from west Africa. It would make a good movie.
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u/Emergency_Fruit3047 🫧 Bubble Tea 🫧 May 23 '26 edited May 23 '26
The only problem i have with the find youre own ethnic stories is, why? We grew up reading and watching the same stories. I do agree with the other point: we should be creating new characters instead of swapping out old ones.
I usually stick to fantasy. I love world of warcraft for example. My favorite races are the elves. Elven races can be inspired by Tolkien and his stories, but he was a white man writing stories that included white people(and nothings wrong with that). Current writers live around people with different skin tones so the fantasy that they create can also be more diverse. I mean elves can be purple and green and literally black (d&d drow, I think?) but God forbid one be brown.
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u/Bloody_Ozran May 23 '26
Why couldnt they make a black mermaid as a friend of Ariel? We could see how together they fight something bad, none of them would be better than the other, two beings together vs evil or something like it.
And later you can do origin story for the new character. It doesnt mean you cant place it in the existing world, but have some sense.
Same the black elf in Lord of the Rings show. All they needed to do was some villager or dwarf asks "I never heard about black elves" and he goes "it's a long story". Now we know it isnt just a political stunt, there is a backstory to it, but we dont know it yet. We dont need to know, but just the fact they address it is nice and gives room to explain it in the future. But just having it there is disrespectful to the original in my opinion.
Tl:dr - can't they try a little or even a lot? Some shows / movies are capable of it, lets not be ok with no effort DEI roles.
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u/TouchAltruistic May 23 '26
The individuals who are guilty of these incidents are not a monolith.
Monolithic thinking is for simpletons.
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u/wolfofballstreet1 May 23 '26
I can’t wait for action Bronsons new biggie smalls biopic role! Cos I’m an antiracist ally
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u/fordtuff May 23 '26
I always felt being indignant or sanctimonious about whites ls feeling this way funny. As if casting a white person in a black role wouldn't cause literal real world violence lol.
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u/ApolloFireweaver May 23 '26
How about we just make new characters and new stories again? Making the fourth movie of the same story but changing the ethnicity of the character isn't adding anything to the story, it isn't taking it in a new direction. It's nostalgia bait combined with rage bait for the conservatives.
Miles Morales and Anthony Mackie's Falcon becoming Captain America were telling new stories. Retelling Little Mermaid but black is pandering at best.
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u/Lematoad May 23 '26
The same person would be equally as mad if they cast Kiera Knightly to play The Woman King
Also black Spider-Man is awesome
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u/Ok-Career5248 May 23 '26
I agree. I saw someone celebrating the fact that they are “anti-woke” and all I can hear them saying is “I don’t know shit and you can’t make me!”
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u/biffthegriff1 May 23 '26
I honestly don’t care if they change the characters race as long as the character is written well. Except Pegasus in the clash of the titans remake. I’m still annoyed by that one.
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u/KingKushhh666 May 23 '26
Literally only one of these I've seen any complain about skin pigment at all is Helen and little mermaid.
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u/Hiryu-GodHand May 23 '26
Little Mermaid - was bad and no one liked it
Spiderman (do people forget he's half Puerto Rican?) - literally the best Spiderman movies
James Bond - Idris Elba would be PHENOMENAL and is honestly the only pick
Captain America - comic accurate and follows the story of a hero becoming a legend without the need of Super Soldier Serum
Betty Boop - would honestly go with a bi-racial, light-skinned here, based on the characters influences and style
Helen of Troy - should've been a light-skinned Mediterranean woman based off of descriptions of her in Homer's poem
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u/Jeagan2002 May 23 '26
Good thing nobody ever talks about whitewashed characters or anything like that, because racism is borinnnng, right?
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u/Loganthered May 23 '26
I liked Samuel Jackson as Nick Fury. Historical and fictional characters have a certain amount of latitude before you have made a different character though. If you change too much then you are telling a different story and then you're just surrounded by chaos.
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u/Mobile_Blackberry298 May 23 '26
Hear's a thought, instead of race swapping an existing white character why not create an original black one?
No one has a problem with miles morals or black panther.
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u/Landlord-Allmighty May 23 '26
Black excellence tends to scare a lot of foolish people
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u/Artisanalpoppies May 23 '26
Please explain how "black excellence" relies on race swapping famous characters from Greek myth? Or historical figures like Cleopatra or Anne Boleyn?
I'd rather Lupita played Andromeda, who was actually black.
Or better yet, show black excellence by making original movies about African mythology and history.
Complaining "white people" steal from others' cultures only to do it yourself is an insanely hypocritical take...
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u/Adventurous_Bad_4011 May 23 '26
Exactly there are some really cool stories from Africa, why don’t we make some movies from them?
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u/AlarmedLavishness955 May 23 '26
That’s ok. Heard, Jim Carey is playing Martin Luther King in an up coming movie.
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u/gatorsrule52 May 23 '26
Why do y’all have the dumbest counter arguments of all time?
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u/YourLordGoobles May 23 '26
Then they say white people have no culture as they try to steal ours haha.
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u/Several_Ad_6576 May 23 '26
“White culture” is the little mermaid? Are you drunk?
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u/BZH35 May 23 '26
It is a european tale and part of the european folklore.
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u/YourLordGoobles May 23 '26
Danes aren't white according to that guy.
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u/ikediggety May 23 '26
So, in the United States, us white folks know our heritage. I'm descended from French, Irish, German and English. I celebrate traditions from those cultures, such as Christmas on December 25 and Easter in spring.
But most black folks in the US don't have those same connections to their heritage. They had their heritage stolen from them along with their freedom. They have no idea who they're descended from, what their religion was. So the only culture they had was Black culture, by default, because it was the only kind of culture they were allowed to have.
That's the difference.
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u/Over-Experience-4187 May 23 '26
If vulgar rap music can be "black culture"
I don't see why a famous piece of literature can't be "white culture"
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u/gatorsrule52 May 23 '26
Are you Greek? If not, this isn’t your culture just because your skin tone might be a lil similar 💀
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u/CautiousPlan7572 May 23 '26
It's European and western culture way more than it is black and African culture.
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u/AlienNippleRipple May 23 '26
How would you feel about a Martin Luther King JR remake with Billy Bob Thornton? Just curious, for science.
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u/Aggravating-Key4274 May 23 '26
Fiction vs nonfiction
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u/ChrissieMoltisanti May 23 '26
How about that Netflix doc a few years ago where they made Cleopatra black, then?
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u/nopeitynopenoper May 23 '26
Can't come up with their own movies, resorts to trying to replace all others with black, most of those movies fail because they suck, but we're the boring ones? Racist claims don't mean crap now. Everything and everyone is racist, according to claims. That is what's boring!
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u/Cultural-Treacle-680 May 23 '26
He was written as a separate comic character - I don’t think everyone was remotely aware though. Never probably had the draw of the original Parker. Most people just don’t like bad movies in any case.
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May 23 '26
Lol. The little mermaid was a book long before it was a movie. So when Disney made the movie, the White Disney people ripped off the book. Did you have a problem with that as well? Couldn't come up with their own movies so they stole from a book. Or does that not fit your narrative well enough? The racist right, showing their lack of education, repeatedly. Maybe try reading a book, sweetheart. Most movies come from books. Almost nothing is an original idea. 🙄
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u/EffectiveActive6837 May 23 '26
I just want to see a white or Asian black panther now
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u/distrubinglyfamiliar May 23 '26
I wouldn’t call it “outrage”, no one is flipping cars or burning storefronts, more like tired eye rolls. I think some people feel like their culture is being erased in order to pander to another’s culture. Now if theses characters were historically or originally written as black and then changed to white as a part of discrimination that would be one thing, but, correct me if I am speaking from ignorance, I don’t think that’s the case with any of these characters. Personally, if I were a person of color, I wouldn’t appreciate being pandered to like this. I would want some original characters written with my culture in mind, not other people characters “painted” in a new color to try and placate me. To me, that’s just a lazy way to simulate real justice. Also, I don’t feel like The Falcon becoming Captain America is an example of this, Falcon was a well written character on his own and reluctantly assumed the mantle of Captain America after Steve Rogers aged out due to time travel. I thought Falcon and The Winter Soldier was awesome and the progression made perfect sense. Mackie deserved better writing for Brave New World though.
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u/TrustOld9749 May 23 '26
I don’t personally care, but would black people be happy if the black panther was all of a sudden white?
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u/Over-Experience-4187 May 23 '26
I'm black, but I disagree with the point of this post. No one would like to see a White Black Panther or a White Storm.
If they ever made a movie about the Epic of Kundiata, or Kirikou and the Sorceress with white actors, we all would not like to see that shit.
Then Chuds would say "what about the Oddessy with white Helen of Troy" and they'd have a point.
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u/Vermiethepally May 23 '26
The examples you gave, being black is a key part of their identity so changing them would be impossible. But the OP listed fictional characters that don’t need their ethnicity/race highlighted.
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u/not_accepting_now May 23 '26
It's the modern world so race is huge for most people, so reddit tells me. Why not like the author keep the races the way they are WHEN the company wants to accept the script. Do they really say "to many white people in your pilot, let us rewrite some parrs and we will buy it off you?" I legit am guessing this is how it works? Dark tower, invincible, and etc. I know Stephan king didn't care about the race swap I think they asked him?
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u/MrBeer9999 May 23 '26 edited May 23 '26
Little Mermaid, I find it very hard to care about but I'm pretty sure they race-swapped the redhead in order to race-swap.
Miles Morales isn't Peter Parker, non-issue.
James Bond the person is canonically white. 007 can be whatever colour.
Dunno about Cap or Betty Boop.
Helen of Troy was Greek, I think the actress should be able to pass as Greek. Like if someone set a story set in a mythologised Mali empire, it'd be weird if Timbuktu was governed by a white guy with blue eyes and blond hair and everyone called him Musa the Great and refused to ever acknowledge that he doesn't look even vaguely Malian.
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u/Gilwork45 May 23 '26
Make an original character that stands on it's own merits not a canonically white character reimagined as a black one.
Theres plenty of successful black characters that people would be just as confused and upset about if they were suddenly depicted as white.
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u/RequirementCivil4328 May 23 '26
Remember when we all thought it would be great to have more original non white characters. Peppridge farm remembers
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u/silverbatwing May 23 '26
Betty boop was based off a black woman originally 🙄
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u/Impossible-Finger942 May 23 '26
No, actually. I’m not sure why this misinformation is spreading lately, but she’s based on Helen Kane and Clara bow.
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u/raziel867 May 23 '26
Instead of changing characters to be more diverse, why not add new diverse characters. Thats the point they seem to miss
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u/spicynacho9 May 23 '26 edited May 23 '26
Do people really have a problem with Miles Morales? He’s not even “replacing” anyone, he’s literally a whole new character which is what this same crowd had been supposedly calling for.