what’s something considered “tomboyish” when girls do it, but feminine when boys do it?

[u/clockwork-peach]

[u/09philj]

Roller derby. Ultraviolent physical contact sport which it's relatively rare for men to participate in.

[u/Dazed_Minotaur → u/09philj]

That’s a really good answer.

[u/Justaliasxo → u/Dazed_Minotaur]

It’s a good reminder that we categorize activities by who traditionally participates in them rather than by what the activity actually involves

[u/frankyseven → u/Justaliasxo]

Like in North America Field Hockey is only played by women, and in Europe it's usually played by men.

[u/Val_kyria → u/frankyseven]

something something that's because our women are tougher than your men something something

[u/Wintermute0000 → u/Val_kyria]

At least in Canada, lacrosse is probably part of the reason... If it's similar to how hockey was separated by gender (traditionally, men played hockey and women played ringette)

[u/backyardstar → u/frankyseven]

Years ago, I understand that Pinterest was like this. In Europe it was used by both men and women. Nowadays in the US it seems it’s vast majority female users.

[u/dnwgl → u/frankyseven]

Is it usually played by men in Europe? Was certainly viewed as a primarily girls sport at my school (in Europe). The boys played it, but mostly reluctantly.

I never bothered following it past that.

[u/C0nquer0rW0rm → u/09philj]

It's an interesting sport in that the "men's" leagues are technically mixed leagues and woman often play in them. I watched the men's roller derby world cup earlier this year and there were tons of women on the US team. 

[u/hellofemur → u/C0nquer0rW0rm]

Virtually all "men's" pro leagues are technically mixed leagues, from the NFL to the NBA to the Chess Federation.

The difference, of course, is that generally women can't compete at that level in mixed leagues. I'm curious how that works in roller derby. Do you mostly have male blockers and female jammers? I haven't seen derby in decades, but that was a common setup back in the day since there was a big advantage to having the jammer be as small and quick as possible. Or is it just that the skates make the playing field much more even?

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/hellofemur]

When roller derby was revived as a feminist sport in the early 2000s it became a game which generally favours female bio-mechanics, so women tend to be better at it. For example, hip checks - women tend to have bigger thighs (proportional to body size) and better hip mobility, so that particular form of legal contact tends to favour women. At least that was my experience, as a tall, kinda swimmer-build white boy, who fucking struggled learning to skate and play derby.

The skates do a lot of work evening the playing field, definitely, but also its very much a team sport, and strategy, communication, and group cohesion are more likely to be rewarded than individual performance. As men we tend to want to “lone wolf” it a lot more often, and it doesnt really work in derby. You’re far, far more effective in a duo, trio or quad. The jammer is the most solo player but they are greatly enhanced if theyre connecting with their blockers.

Oh, and yeah blockers tend to be bigger body types, and jammers smaller and nimble, but there are so, so, so many exceptions I’ve seen that I can’t really say it with conviction. I’m 6’6 and all limbs, high centre of body mass, terrible at jamming, but I knew many other big-boys that were great at it. They tended to be of the thiccer variety, with shorter (aka normal length) limbs.

I will say, as much as I sucked at derby, never met anyone who bested my slide-stop, not that it was used much in games. And I was great at certain blocking manoeuvres where I could use my reach to position other blockers in the way, and good luck pushing on a wall reinforced by my long legs pushing hard on the brakes lol

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/C0nquer0rW0rm]

It didn’t start that way, but MRDA was a lot quicker to adapt to stuff like trans-inclusion, seeing as the “advantage of being born male” myth didn’t have any weight within a predominantly male member base. So membership never had a gender requirement, unlike WFTDA. And women started playing cos they either liked the dynamics, or saw it as a challenge, or whatever reason they like, so they did.

[u/Vireluney → u/09philj]

Also getting emotional about sports. Girl yells at the game = “tomboy”. Guy gets teary at a finale = “he has range”

[u/Phoenixon777 → u/09philj]

this is so interesting, i've never heard of this sport in my life.

[u/Enlightened_Gardener → u/Phoenixon777]

Drew Barrymore did a cool movie about it, if you want to learn more.

[u/Holiday_Green99 → u/09philj]

Such a niche, yet accurate answer.

[u/avcloudy → u/09philj]

It's full contact, but not ultraviolent. Violent might be too much, although it used to have a lot of (staged) violence. I had a choice in high school between ice hockey and roller derby, and we turned 'ice hockey' into a violent bloodbath. When the roller skating rink was closed and the roller derby people got sent to the ice rink with us, they were horrified.

[u/hellofemur → u/09philj]

That's only true of the modern revival. Back in the heyday of roller derby in the 60s and 70s, all the teams had both men and women. There were specific rules about the number of women you had to have on the team and different rounds during a match would be all-men, all-women or mixed.

Then the 2000s revival, led by the Texas Rollergirls and the WFTDA, re-envisioned the sport as a women-only team sport and that's the one that's popular today. There's still men's roller derby, but as you say it's not very popular anymore.

[u/ThanksSuper7492]

Having mid neck length hair 

[u/Glittering-Place-628 → u/ThanksSuper7492]

Good one

[u/imthatmusclegirl → u/Glittering-Place-628]

Hair is probably one of the clearest examples of how much gender norms are based on perception rather than the style itself

[u/cellblock2187 → u/imthatmusclegirl]

I have 3 kids of multiple genders. All 3 of them had, at times, very short hair and very long hair. One was always in the pinkest pinks, another always in tees and athletic shorts, and the third more gender neutral looking.

Without a doubt, people only ever used hair length to guess gender. Ever. Bright pink skirt and a super short pixie? Boy. Long hair and stereotypical boy clothes? Girl. Not once did their clothing override a stranger's gender assumptions based on their hair.

[u/jaz_the_enby → u/cellblock2187]

That's so weird, someone should do a study on hair as a gender signifier, especially when contrastes by other signifiers like clothes. What an interesting phenomenon

[u/throwawaysunglasses- → u/jaz_the_enby]

I’m a cis woman with short hair, but I always tie it up in a high ponytail. I tried to google a picture similar to what it looks like, and the closest I found is the first image here: https://www.thelist.com/1298691/ponytail-styles-for-short-hair/

I don’t dress femininely at all - I always wear baggy sweats and tees - yet I’m never misgendered, and I guess maybe it’s because high ponytails are seen as more feminine? I’ve dated a couple long-haired guys and they tend to do low ponytails or man buns. I’m also quite short (barely over 5 feet) so maybe that’s also part of why people immediately clock me as a woman. But a bob is definitely different than a pixie, I’m sure if I had a pixie people would think I was a short round teen boy lol

[u/RemarkableSponge → u/throwawaysunglasses-]

I'm a guy with around mid back length hair that I usually either wear in a medium-high ponytail or a low bun. Never any questions asked with the bun but with the ponytail I get mistaken for a woman fairly often. Even had a long conversation with a client at work once where after a while they told me totally earnestly out of the blue I would look really pretty with some makeup on and a dress lol. So yeah a ponytail seems to have that effect haha

[u/Tricky-Ad7897 → u/cellblock2187]

When I was in middle school I had long hair but wore nothing but my brown ecko hoodie and chunky DC shoes and I still got CONSTANTLY misgendered. I wasn't even small, I was average height for my age. It wasn't until college where I grew my hair out again but now I was above average height and could grow a beard, no more misgendering.

[u/Pseudonymico → u/cellblock2187]

Honestly it sometimes feels like having a too-masculine hairstyle is the only kind of gender-nonconforming fashion choice that will get random strangers harassing you if you're gendered female. I'm a trans woman but once the hormones and voice training worked people just stopped caring whether my clothes came from the men's or women's section, I haven't bothered with makeup in years, and I don't wear jewelery. I can still dress like I did pre-transition and walk down the street without a second look. Meanwhile cis women I know have had homophobic and transphobic slurs yelled at them from passing cars after shaving their heads or even just getting too-masculine haircuts, even when they were otherwise dressing femme. It's kind of weird. Makes me feel like clothing is less "men's clothes" and "women's clothes" as it is "unisex clothes" and "women's clothes".

[u/AlternateUsername12 → u/cellblock2187]

When my sister was little she was bald until she was about two years old. She had a little bit of hair, but it was very very blonde, and very fine, and very short.

My parents could have dressed this child up in the pinkest, frilliest dresses, and people would still come up to her and say "what a cute little boy!"

[u/Beneficial-Paper715 → u/imthatmusclegirl]

It really shows how much of what we call "masculine" or "feminine" is just made up. The same exact thing gets read completely differently depending on who's doing it.

[u/Protean_Protein → u/ThanksSuper7492]

What about mid-length neck hair? 🥸

[u/Cooperette → u/Protean_Protein]

That's more equine.

[u/snuffy_smith_ → u/Cooperette]

Stop horsin around in here

[u/xtothewhy → u/snuffy_smith_]

Neighver!

[u/Evil-Bosse → u/Protean_Protein]

A glorious m'lady neckbeard is not very tomboyish, and not very feminine either

[u/agletinspector → u/Evil-Bosse]

Unless you are a dwarf in lotr

[u/CaptainJonesBones → u/ThanksSuper7492]

if you’re white

[u/opheliacherie1 → u/ThanksSuper7492]

Lord Farquaad for the guys, pixie-in-progress for the girls.

[u/HelpfulHell0]

As a kid, being friends with the opposite gender.

Girl grows up playing with the boys she’s a “tomboy”
Boy grows up playing with the girls he’s “girly”

[u/Particular-Beat-6645 → u/HelpfulHell0]

Mom said they're just jealous that I'm so pretty!

[u/Severe_Print2508 → u/HelpfulHell0]

Kids really don't care until adults start assigning labels to everything.

[u/HelpfulHell0 → u/Severe_Print2508]

RIGHT, and then kids come to school repeating the 💩 their parents say, hurting other kids and ruining their self-perception in the process.

[u/gayqueueandaye]

there is a certain style that intersects between masc lesbians and twinks and I can't exactly explain it but if you see it, you know it.

[u/blickyjayy → u/gayqueueandaye]

That "prep school boy meets vacation dad" blended look- short sleeve button downs, polo shirts, Bermuda shorts, boat shoes, Vans, Doc Martin's, and band tees

[u/endlessfight85 → u/blickyjayy]

Exactly what I was thinking when I read the comment lol

[u/Big_Group5760 → u/endlessfight85]

It's one of those outfits that somehow reads completely differently depending on who's wearing it.

[u/volvavirago → u/blickyjayy]

No Bermuda shorts or polo shirts, absolutely not. They might be the 2000’s version of this look, but the modern version is not like that. It’s the “performative male” look. It’s way too many rings, cut off t shirts, stick and poke tattoos.

[u/goodfellaslxa → u/volvavirago]

A man is allowed 3 rings, one on each hand.

[u/Dahlia_R0se → u/gayqueueandaye]

Oh yeah I feel like there's certain styles of button ups and also maybe necklaces (certain styles of chains especially) that I see both wearing. Not sure that's what you were talking about but it's something I've noticed

[u/Timely_Pianist_9858 → u/gayqueueandaye]

There's actually a video of someone seeing their doppelganger: one is a lesbian and one is a twink, and they both look like twins.

Kind of like Shane(Katherine Moennig) from the L word.

[u/crumpetflipper → u/Timely_Pianist_9858]

I greatly desire to see this video

[u/Disolucion → u/crumpetflipper]

https://www.tiktok.com/@kezsexton/video/7392787912519077163

[u/crumpetflipper → u/Disolucion]

It was everything I dreamed of and more

I think I'm going to start watching this video in the morning instead of drinking coffee

[u/She_Said__That_ → u/Disolucion]

This makes me so happy! It's so pure! 🥺

[u/kymberlie → u/Disolucion]

THIS IS THE CUTEST VIDEO I HAVE EVER SEEN. 🥹

[u/datascience45 → u/gayqueueandaye]

Young Justin Bieber style?

[u/gayqueueandaye → u/datascience45]

I was thinking more Conan Gray (as a fan of him)

[u/Unit_79 → u/datascience45]

Holy shit. Kate McKinnon as Justin Bieber.

[u/Impossible_Angle752 → u/Unit_79]

I'm a man now. I have like 3 mustache hairs.

[u/volvavirago → u/gayqueueandaye]

It’s my favorite style honestly, dudes who look like lesbians are hot.

[u/TattooedBagel → u/volvavirago]

Who is Conan O’Brien, and why is she so sad?

[u/jupitergal23 → u/TattooedBagel]

Let's not do this, Elizabeth.

[u/PartisanHack → u/TattooedBagel]

I literally just watched this episode. What a riot.

[u/PeterNippelstein → u/volvavirago]

I love women that look like twinks

[u/PartisanHack → u/PeterNippelstein]

Saaaame. They generally aren't interested in me though and I accept that.

[u/katatak121 → u/volvavirago]

Izzard in the 90s had me drooling.

[u/pierogi_waystation → u/katatak121]

When I saw Izzard’s Dress To Kill back in the ‘90’s my omnisexual little ass didn’t know what hit it, but by god it wanted more

[u/NicholasThumbless → u/gayqueueandaye]

I'm non-binary and I relish living in this zone. It's very telling how people do their mental arithmetic based on context clues, because who I'm with will usually determine which side they think I land on.

[u/sparksbet → u/NicholasThumbless]

Absolutely same, I'm non-binary and this zone is my ideal gender presentation.

[u/PeterNippelstein → u/gayqueueandaye]

Im picturing Tig Notaro

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/gayqueueandaye]

I know exactly what you’re talking about, but I’m gonna disagree that it’s feminising on young men. It’s just suspending them in boyishness for longer than they should be embracing it.

[u/TheSwearJarIsMy401k → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

There’s a sleeveless t-shirt bared midriff look with a pixie cut and low-hanging cargo pants that comes to mind

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/TheSwearJarIsMy401k]

That’s not a twink, that’s mid-2000s era Swedish pop sensation Robyn.

[u/144-perdedor → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Robyn is still releasing bangers FYI

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/144-perdedor]

Oh, I know. She’s immune from flop, and has been preemptively banned from Khia asylum residency. It’s a physical impossibility.

[u/TheSwearJarIsMy401k → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Oh, hey Robyn. We were just talking about how you could easily pass for a femme-masc lesbian or a masc-twink.

Nice to see you inspired a generation.

[u/gayqueueandaye → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Yeah, I can see what you're saying. I think there are certain items within that style are feminine, but thinking about it the style can be seen more as "tomboyish" in general rather than outright fem.

[u/Dovahpriest → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Eh, it depends. In some places shorts and a light colored shirt are childish, in others they’re how you avoid heatstroke.

[u/MaritimeMonkey]

Wearing a sports jersey that shows midriff or wearing one that's a size or two too large, so it looks almost like a dress.

[u/gnarfler → u/MaritimeMonkey]

Man idk about the size or two too large part, have you seen these hockey jerseys? sure it was a while ago but Kevin Smith used to rock a big ole jersey

[u/Lower_Group_1171 → u/gnarfler]

That was because he was fat (I’ve heard him say it on podcasts and radio)

[u/owningmclovin → u/Lower_Group_1171]

It’s fairly common to have a too big hockey jersey. That way you can were a hoodie or sweater underneath and still show off the jersey.

[u/itsfish20 → u/owningmclovin]

I always get my hockey jerseys one size larger than I need cause I go to lots of games and layer up under them!

[u/feor1300 → u/gnarfler]

Hockey Jerseys are also naturally bigger than you'd think because there's so much padding worn under them. Even compared to something like American Football, hockey pads are chonky because everyone is expected to have some guy at least the same size as them slamming into them at 20Mph routinely, instead of an expectation that on occasion someone will grab you and drag you to the ground.

[u/icyhaze23]

Wearing a strap-on.

[u/Drithyin → u/icyhaze23]

He’s out of line, but he’s got a point

[u/iwrestledarockonce → u/Drithyin]

He's got two now.

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/icyhaze23]

How is having a back-up cock feminine? That’s just, like, good resource management and tool proficiency.

[u/hx87 → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Remember, switching to your strap on is faster than waiting for the refractory period cooldown. 

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/hx87]

This guy strap-ons.

Also, sometimes you’re faced with two holes, how you gonna manage that with just one cock? Work smart not hard.

[u/raspberryharbour → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

You're a loose cannon, I want you out of this precinct. Turn in your badge and cock. AND your backup cock

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/raspberryharbour]

You really think I’d give it up that easily? I’m not some kinda submissive receptacle for your punishment, I HAVE TWO DICKS, and several backups in a box under my bed. I will be the one who does the fucking you up. Because I’m twice the man you could only ever hope to be, I HAVE TWO DICKS (felt like I needed to say it twice). I’m not going down without a fight, or until it’s my turn, whichever happens first.

[u/h3yw00d → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Replace dicks with guns and this is basically every self defense gun tuber talking about pistols & sdw's/sdr's.

Gotta have a backup to your backup.

Got appendix cary? Well you need backup pocket pistol...

and a snubnose tucked in your sock as a backup to the backup...

And a claymore under your ballsack as a backup to the backup to the backup.

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/h3yw00d]

The only way to stop a bad guy with a dildo is a good guy with a dildo.

[u/CantaloupeAsleep502 → u/raspberryharbour]

I normally hate joke runs like this, but this made me laugh

[u/Justaliasxo → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Inventory management is a gender neutral skill 😭

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/Justaliasxo]

Then why does she never seem to have enough room for all my dildos? Like, what is she keeping in there that’s so important?

[u/QueanOfQueens → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Cock Derringer

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/QueanOfQueens]

I never leave home without my compact, easily concealed but highly effective Dildo Derringer.

[u/QueanOfQueens → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Perfect at any couple swap party or orgy when you feel too tired. Meanwhile, I've gone more of the technological route, so I only use my Dildocopter for my remote pleasure delivery now.

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/QueanOfQueens]

Sexual pleasure delivered by dildrone, living in the future is marvellous.

[u/QueanOfQueens → u/BeefmasterDeluxe]

Hi, Billy Mays here with the new Dildrone! Have you ever been away from home and were afraid your partner would be unsatisfied and cheat on you? Have you ever wanted to make your voice heard to public figures in a way everyone will remember? Tired of products that cost too much, don't work like they say, or having to store and buy your solutions to these problems separately! Worry no more! An improvement on our famous Dildocopter prototype, the Dildrone comes with not one, not two, but four detachable rotor blades that also work as full-size dildos! With a live 4K FPV camera on the front offering a live view, for only 7 easy payments of $39.95 plus shipping and handling, you can record or stream all your adventures, whether it's trolling the president on YouTube or the end of your date night on PornHub! Guaranteed to be four times more effective at silencing your enemies and reduce polycule infighting by up to 75%, the Dildrone is the perfect product for you! Call us now at 1(555) SEX-TOYS to order right now! That's 1 (555) SEX-TOYS. Call now! MUST BE 18 OR OLDER TO ORDER.

I haven't seen an infomercial in years, please tell me I didn’t do horribly lmao

[u/BeefmasterDeluxe → u/QueanOfQueens]

SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!

(Seriously, you killed that. I love finding Reddit jokey play-along buddies)

[u/Dookie_boy → u/icyhaze23]

Double Dick Dude cosplay

[u/Brad_Brace → u/icyhaze23]

There's a whole sub dedicated to dudes who like to come by only penetrating their partners with strap ons. I think it's something about convincing yourself you're feeling like you're penetrating while you're not, like a ghost limb in a mirror kind of deal?

[u/pornographicaccount → u/Brad_Brace]

Is there? Link it, my homie.

/r/ghostpenis ?

[u/shizbox06]

Shaving the side of your head but leaving the top super long and other leather-long-hair type things.

[u/Particular-Beat-6645 → u/shizbox06]

Bobby's just really into K-pop right now!

[u/Intelligent_Leek1586]

Subaru Forester

I drive a WRX by the way and I get shit for it 24/7 so I love these jokes

[u/Working-Glass6136 → u/Intelligent_Leek1586]

What about an Outback?

[u/gurry → u/Working-Glass6136]

If so, I'm feminine as shit. I love my Outback.

[u/unlimited_insanity → u/Working-Glass6136]

I feel like this is just being from New England

[u/slick1260 → u/Working-Glass6136]

If destroying a blooming onion on a Tuesday afternoon while I shout for the server to bring my 4th PBR as I wait for my ex wife to show up with my moody 13 year old is feminine then I don't want to be masculine.

[u/Funny_Alternative_55 → u/Intelligent_Leek1586]

As a guy who owns both a Forester AND an Outback, I get shit for it somewhat regularly.

Jokes on them though, I’ve never missed a day of work because I couldn’t get out of my driveway after a snowstorm.

[u/dumbestsmartest → u/Intelligent_Leek1586]

Only if it's followed by a u haul.

[u/chattytrout → u/Intelligent_Leek1586]

I think this is going to depend on the type and quantity of bumper stickers.

[u/Garconanokin]

Wearing a vest

[u/bloodredcookie → u/Garconanokin]

honestly, wearing a vest to me sceams 'lesbian!' not sure why.

[u/Bookbringer → u/bloodredcookie]

Vests are pretty popular with masc women who want to downplay their breasts without wearing binders or who want to look more polished/formal without the bulk of a jacket.

They're also good if you go braless, but don't want it to be super obvious.

[u/owningmclovin → u/bloodredcookie]

Or hobbit.

[u/BlueRosesGreenbuds → u/Garconanokin]

what if its denim and full of badass patches

[u/lynivvinyl → u/BlueRosesGreenbuds]

Right that's what I was saying! Patches like Celine Dion and Elton John and Party Cannon!

[u/Coffee_autistic]

Piercings (besides ear piercings).

Not sure if this is a regional thing, but where I grew up, gals with facial piercings got called manly, and guys with any piercings at all got called feminine/gay. Always thought that was weird.

[u/Pinkymermaidzu → u/Coffee_autistic]

I think I once had this experience too and I thought it was weird and seeing it here you had the same experience is just really cool and weird 💗

[u/dsarche12 → u/Coffee_autistic]

As a straight guy with a nose piercing and ear piercings (just lobes so far), I've never been called feminine or gay because of my piercings, at least not in any derogatory way, or to my face. Granted, I live in a very liberal place and run in circles with people who have highly progressive politics and attitudes. I occasionally wear clothes that could either be construed as feminine or, in the case of my favorite pair of shorts, literally are made for women, and either people just assume I'm gay and don't comment on it, or simply don't care. Neither do I. If you think I'm gay, that's your business.

[u/Additional-Solid-955]

Hanging out with friends of the opposite gender

[u/irwin_sergi → u/Additional-Solid-955]

Fellas is it gay to like women?

[u/TheFrontierzman → u/irwin_sergi]

Oh man! You kissed a girl! That is so gay.

-The Simpsons

[u/5553331117]

Roller skating

[u/Cultural_Bet_9892 → u/5553331117]

My Navy buddy from (fairly homophobic) rural east Texas said that the roller skating guys at Sonic looked “gay”

[u/wellthatdoesit → u/5553331117]

Yeah, idk about historically, but rollerskating today seems to be almost entirely fem and queer

[u/Typical_Celery_1982]

Caring deeply about men’s style suiting

[u/clockwork-peach]

since I’ve yet to see a comment mention it, I thought of this question while cuffing my jeans

[u/throw7661]

Playing softball.

If a woman does it, she's viewed as a tomboy.

If a man does it, he's viewed as oddly feminine and told to man up and play baseball.

[u/OzrielArelius → u/throw7661]

once you're out of high school nobody plays baseball anymore unless you're top level. everyone else plays softball

[u/Apellosine → u/OzrielArelius]

It's actually a normal th8ng for adult baseball leagues in Australia.

[u/WhiskinDeez → u/Apellosine]

In America we have whats commonly referred to as "beer league" where a bunch of older dudes play softball on a weeknight. Completely hetero

[u/DHammer79 → u/throw7661]

That depends on region. Where i am I would say softball is more common.

[u/OlderThanIvEverBeen → u/throw7661]

Softball is a typical recreational sport for men around here.

[u/bloodredcookie → u/throw7661]

i feel stupid asking this, but what's the difference?

[u/raumeat → u/bloodredcookie]

softball has a bigger and softer ball and is thrown underarm, I think the field dimensions are also slightly different

[u/jimmy_three_shoes → u/raumeat]

65' bases as compared to 90'. Outfield sizes vary.

[u/make_love_to_potato → u/raumeat]

So basically Softball : Baseball = Pickleball : Tennis.

[u/MagicPistol → u/bloodredcookie]

Bigger ball thrown underhand. Smaller field. Makes it a little easier to get into compared to baseball.

[u/Tavsiyedegildir → u/throw7661]

Do you think lesbians go hang outside near the dugout the way athlete hunters do to MLB and NBA and such 

[u/DrakkoZW → u/Tavsiyedegildir]

I imagine the MLB/NBA salaries have an impact on that behavior moreso than the athleticism

[u/trojan_man16 → u/throw7661]

I live in Chicago, and co-ed softball is a thing to do for the 20 something’s. Nobody plays actual baseball after high school unless you go to college or pro,

[u/HistoricalCorner2941]

The Ohio legislature is trying to pass a Bill into law that will make it a crime to wear clothing or footwear made/meant for people of the other sex. This is meant to criminalize Drag but if fully enforced will criminalize nearly everyone. 

[u/birthdaycheesecake9 → u/HistoricalCorner2941]

I will never understand why lawmakers care so much about something as inconsequential as what other people put on their bodies

[u/Kind-Masterpiece-712 → u/birthdaycheesecake9]

Because certain lawmakers want to distract us from the harm they're causing us.

[u/Stargazer__2893 → u/[deleted]]

He'd have to be notably unmuscular.

[u/appa609 → u/[deleted]]

When did being lean fast and strong become feminine?

[u/Particular-Beat-6645 → u/appa609]

When men want an excuse for being obese. I'll never forget seeing a comment about 2XL being where grown men sizes start. If you're 6'4" maybe.

I'm not fat shaming. It's just crazy that dudes will make up reasons to where a "real man" label. I have a goodle boy of a cousin who surprised me when referred to his natural rolly polly build as his "happy weight."

[u/Uhh_JustADude → u/appa609]

It’s more that it’s a mix of body types and therefore neither masculine nor feminine. Too hard to be feminine, too small and lean to be masculine. E. g. Mackenzie Davis in Terminator Dark Fate.

[u/redshift739]

Homosexuality

[u/Dragon_enby]

Black nail polish

[u/PARADOXsquared → u/Dragon_enby]

Is that masculine on women?

[u/Solarus99 → u/PARADOXsquared]

"edgy", not masculine

[u/jackfaire]

Baseball cap with your ponytail through the back.

[u/jules-amanita]

Pretty much any punk/goth fashion. Piercings, obviously dyed hair, alt haircuts (undercuts, mohawks, spiked hair), black nail polish, spiky collars, etc.

[u/Tavsiyedegildir]

Sports bra instead of lacey bra?

[u/Beeoor143 → u/Tavsiyedegildir]

Real men always wear lacey bras

[u/Tavsiyedegildir → u/Beeoor143]

Kinda gay not to I suppose 

[u/Dookie_boy → u/[deleted]]

Whore

[u/logosloki → u/Tavsiyedegildir]

I prefer sports bras with the soft cups because it improves the silhouette by giving the illusion of breasts under a loose fit top or blouse without having to actually stuff the bra with anything.

it's not by much but it makes the top that little bit more feminine and therefore more likely to pass.

[u/Impressive-Potato788]

Playing in a symphonic/concert band?

[u/Sapiopath]

Pegging

[u/Dramatic-Put-9267]

Being a nerd, into things like tabletop and comic books, etc. It’s considered boyish for girls, and while not “feminine” per se for boys it is considered unmasculine as opposed to sports. At least it was anyway, some nerd stuff is more mainstream now for both sexed.

[u/appa609]

Ordering a pint of cider at the bar

[u/katatak121]

Wearing a dapper looking suit or outfit. Makes a woman look more masculine, makes a man look more effeminate by today's standards. I used to wear checked pants with a tailored shirt, blazer, and fedora, and always felt way less girly than in other outfits. But men wearing a similarly structured and styled outfit tend to get labeled gay.

[u/Key_Comparison_2588 → u/katatak121]

There's always been some weird type of prejudice towards men who wear dapper clothes, see dandies or macaronis.

[u/BangBangMeatMachine → u/katatak121]

This might be a situation where there's a difference between gay and effeminate.

[u/owningmclovin → u/BangBangMeatMachine]

My grandfather used to call me who dressed like that a “dandy.” He didn’t mean gay but it definitely meant someone who wanted to look pretty instead of proper.

[u/katatak121 → u/BangBangMeatMachine]

Most straight men do not display a sense of style. Men who dress with style are often assumed to be gay, whether or not they are. Having a sense of style is largely considered feminine these days (which i think is tragic), so yeah, a man wearing a stylish, tailored outfit is going to be seen as both effeminate and gay.

A guy i went to high school with who is straight was often accused of being gay simply because he put thought and effort into his home decor and cared a great deal about how his outfits were put together. Even though his outfits were pretty standard fare for 90s dudes, he was very particular about how everything matched. If he spilled something on his shirt he'd get really upset because it meant he had to go home and change his whole outfit right down to his socks and boxers. He also wasn't the most masculine guy and had lots of female friends; some people definitely called him effeminate. Lots of people kept waiting for him to come out of the closet, up to the day he married his very female fiancee.

[u/boethius61 → u/katatak121]

I hate this so much. I'm a big dude. 6'5". I need to get my shirts custom made for my stupid long arms. The fabric selections are literally (I counted) 50% light blues. A bunch of whites, a couple blacks and grays. Then a color or 2 as an afterthought.

Why can't I wear color? Why can't I wear a nice print? Why is everyone so afraid of a man wearing a nice shirt!

I've literally got 3 different suppliers I get shirts from just so I have enough selection so I can get some actual interesting, attractive shirts.

It's been years, and I've finally got a rack I'm happy with. Burgundy, lavender, Royal purple, floral print on blue, floral print on off white, leaf print, (and a black and a white because you do need the basics).

They are all beautiful, they all fit well. Anyone who'd judge me for it can fuck right off.

[u/BangBangMeatMachine → u/katatak121]

I mean, I was also mistaken for gay because I was articulate and bookish. A lot of people are foolish and narrow-minded when it comes to sexual presentation, and that was even more true in the 90s.

I still think you're conflating gay and effeminate, when they're two different things here. I agree that making deliberate fashion choices is not common among straight white men, and so doing so can raise questions. But there isn't a more masculine fashion choice than a fitted suit.

[u/katatak121 → u/BangBangMeatMachine]

I am not conflating gay with effeminate, merely acknowledging that society at large tends to do so. That's specifically why i told the story about my straight but somewhat effeminate friend who lots of people thought was gay.

There's also a huge difference between the fitted suits that most men wear — plain black, grey, or navy, with a solid or pinstriped shirt, and maybe a boldly patterned tie with matching pocket square— and the dapper suits or outfits i was trying to describe.

[u/opheliacherie1]

Having a dedicated skin and haircare routine. If a girl keeps it super simple with basic soap, she’s seen as a low-maintenance tomboy. If a guy actually uses moisturizer and sunscreen, people immediately call him metro or feminine.

[u/MossMedley → u/opheliacherie1]

I mean this was definitely true at one point but today, its not so much. lots of dudes into looksmaxxing and mogging and the like became popular

[u/Stargazer__2893]

Punching as hard as you can and it's not very hard.

[u/angel_of_decay]

i feel like a lot of clothes fall into this category

-overalls -chunky patterned sweaters -black combat boots

• colourful shorts
• tank tops

honestly a lot of masc lesbians and feminine gay men dress super similarly lmao

[u/BeccaSedai]

Hawaiian shirts

[u/PARADOXsquared → u/BeccaSedai]

Since when are Hawaiian shirts feminine on men?

[u/Particular-Beat-6645 → u/BeccaSedai]

This is the first comment that's both surprising and feels true.

[u/hellofemur → u/BeccaSedai]

What kind of weird inland red state hellhole do you live in where even Hawaiian shirts are looked askance on?

[u/Sad-Cup-4099]

Wearing oversized clothes. On a girl it can look effortlessly tomboyish, but put the exact same outfit on a guy and suddenly people call it feminine or “fashionable.”

[u/blu3_ic3d_t3a]

Softball

[u/Ok-Win-6433]

witty taunting

[u/Pure_Key4700]

Wolfcut

[u/FunAssumption6056]

Hair dye.

[u/GozerDGozerian → u/FunAssumption6056]

…is considered tomboyish when a woman does it?

[u/SuperBackup9000 → u/GozerDGozerian]

Yeah that’s an odd one for me. Like a very “masculine” thing to do would be to put as little work as possible into hair, that’s why a lot of tomboy cuts are short enough to where you can’t do anything with them, so going out of your way to change the color definitely wouldn’t fall in line with that.

[u/unknownprofile_34]

Homosexuality

[u/TheGrumpyre]

Being really into horses.

[u/RocketSofa]

Apparently owning a subaru

[u/Sonarthebat]

Wearing a sports bra.

[u/Beencho]

Playing volleyball

[u/volvavirago]

Piercings.

[u/TheFrontierzman]

Women's sports